An analysis by an A.I., so take it with a little bit of sodium chloride.
Strategic Move — STG plans to destroy Sutliff's specialized manufacturing equipment as part of their acquisition strategy. This is intended to prevent competition by ensuring that no other company can use the equipment to produce similar products.
Facility Closures — Sutliff's closure is scheduled by the end of the first quarter of 2025. This is part of a broader strategy by STG to consolidate and streamline operations, which includes closing facilities and reducing brand diversity.
Market Control — The destruction of equipment is a deliberate effort by STG to control the market. By eliminating the possibility of competitors acquiring the machinery, STG aims to maintain dominance in the pipe tobacco industry.
Job Impact — The closure of Sutliff and the destruction of its equipment will likely lead to job losses. While STG has plans to move some employees to other facilities, the exact number of employees who will be retained is uncertain.
Historical Context — Unlike the natural closure of McClelland in 2018, which was due to sourcing difficulties and retirement, Sutliff's closure is a strategic decision despite its profitability. This highlights a shift in industry dynamics towards consolidation and market control.
<< This morning Sutliff sent out a price increase notice on Lane/STG prices to all of our customers. This is creating confusion as our customers are thinking there is another increase to Lane/STG prices that were previously published the first of January. This is not the case. Sutliff has been a distributor of these products for years and continues to be until our closure in a few months. Therefore, we need to increase our distribution prices that take into effect the price increase Lane/STG sent out the first of January.
Sorry for any confusion. Our email is not a second price increase on these products, however just Sutliff as a distributor reacting to the same price increase all STG/Lane customers received.
Please contact your salesmen if you have any further questions.
Man , I cant believe MacBaren Golden Extra didn't make the mark .There aren't many quality Burley blends on the market , in general , and few offered in bulk . I'm wondering , after things get settled down , if someone will rethink some blends
The idea of being ok with folks switching over to C&D aromatics is disconcerting because , imho , their products are just awful and STG can do way better than taking that attitude . I very much enjoy aromatics and Sutliff/MacBaren made the best by far .
I truly hope someone will rethink some of the blends back into existence in the near future
I know I sound like I'm bitching . I'm thankful that MacBaren Scottish and Sutliff Z50 Black Cordial made it !!
Id like to add that I think STG has done such a fantastic job , honestly . Their Half and Half is such an improvement from when it used to taste like Listerine [ I think that's when Pinkerton made it , I forget ] . All the OTC brands and the Captain Black products STG makes are fantastic .
Just rethink Golden Extra , please . I'm down to 2.5 lbs
@Ruffinogold Funny, my thoughts are the same as yours….except exactly the opposite. C&D (mostly) 👍🏻….Sutliff 😖 All of the Sutliff blends I ever had needed the moisture rung out of them (except Mixture 79) after some serious dry time there was only about 1/4-1/3 of a tin of tobacco left and that was still pretty wet, but smokeable. There was so much moisture in them that they rusted the sealed tins they came in.
@RockyMountainBriar ... lol . I came up with a saying about 15 years ago on an old forum ... " It takes a pro to smoke an Aro " .. lol I hear ya . Man , Im gonna miss MacBaren Golden Extra .. I smoke it everyday since 2000 . Prior to that I smoked MacBaren Scottish as a go to , so I'll go back to that and Ill be ok but damn it . Ya know what , I really really still miss McClelland . Im still recovering and then this mishap McCelland had an aromatic called Easy Street and it was a total mind bender
Anyway , Im getting used to blends disappearing . Since I started in 78 , theres a ton of things I smoked that are long gone . Nothing is scared it seems
@Ruffinogold Ahh, McClelland, I started this journey much later at the end of 2012. I was just learning my way around and ended up at a brick-and-mortar for “smoke-in” that a friend worked at. Sadly it was right after the time that indoor smoking was made a crime here in Montana……the shop proprietors were renegades and we did it anyway😬. I tried a sample tobak or two, and received several small samples to take home. I also got one of the door prizes, a flat black Zippo pipe lighter. Every time I strike it up it reminds me of that friend whom helped me start to figure out the pipe. He passed soon after that get together😢. I never got to make him the custom pipe I had planned to surprise him with. I was just figuring out how to make pipes as well. Back to McClelland…One of those tobaccos was Beacon, which I thoroughly enjoy. At the time, I was only buying a tin at a time trying to figure out my likes and dislikes. Well, you guessed it, one tin is all I got. I have about half of it left, and save it for special occasions. I did find out that I did not enjoy Beacon Extra, at the time, it had too much Perique. Now, with a few years of pipe smoking under my belt, I think I would enjoy it too, on occasion. I have found Sam Gawith’s “Cabbie’s Mixture” to be an ok substitute. I’d like to get my hands on some of the uncut rope some day.
@RockyMountainBriar . Sorry to hear about your friend . My best friend and fellow pipe smoker , Simon , passed a couple months ago and there will forever be a void for me , no doubt . I really miss him
Ya know , I never had a " cellar " for decades and decades until the damn internet , lol . I just bought what I wanted when I wanted . After the McClelland disaster and Dunhill being out of production a short time , is what kinda started me to start stocking up a bit but not heavy . I used to be a Germain Royal Jersey Perique smoker , I loved it , but it got stupid to find and I havent seen it in stock anywhere in years and I no longer care . Peterson Elizabethan is kinda similar enough . I have 1 unopened tin left and Ill save it for a special occasion ... like if I make it with a 25 year old buxom redhead or something truly cool like that McClelland was the premier American manufacturer and that will never happen again , sadly . But the thing is that there really is a good bit of blends still available , though we lost at least 100 blends just the other day .
What bugs me is the " flavor profile " of a manufacturer , when they go away , then that flavor profile is gone forever .Each has their own and its such a cool thing
@Ruffinogold I used to smoke a lot of C&D and Sutliff aromatics until I was introduced to the Kohlhase & Kopp aromatics and Rattray's aromatics that were made by K&K. This lead me to other European aros made by companies like Dan Tobacco. Now that both Kopp and HU are being sold in the U.S., I'm hoping they make some more of their aromatics available.
I had a bad experience with Lakeland blends back in the 70s and it was only about 10 years ago that I decided to give them a try again. Now I enjoy them.
I get what you are saying about having a cellar. I didn't start buying multiple tins of pipe tobacco blends until about 10 years ago. I still don't have a cellar as huge as some of the guys on the other forums - mine is only about 13 lbs. total.
@PappyJoe .. Lakelands are okish for me but not what I go for . Its one of those blends like Mixture 79 or Royal Yacht .. theyre so different and are usually gonna go one way or the other . The European Aromatics , in general , are too " bright " for me , mostly . They seem to incorporate a lot of Virginia and then flavor it with flavorings that seem very bright tasting . I love Peter Heinrich non aromatics but their aromatics are way to bright for me , as an exampe . I cant figure a better word description other than bright but its different than the American stuff thats further processed and incorporates way more burley , I think . Dont get me wrong there are some I really like . I think Ashtons Gold Rush is wonderful and G&H Top Black Cherry is maybe one of the best blends on Earth . Dans Devils Holliday is a trip but that type of aromatic [ very flavored ] is one I cant do often . Tell ya what , Peter Stokkebye Optimum is very nice and their Peaches and Cream too
I tend to get an all black cavendish , a simple one .. say like BCA or Smokers Pride BC and add a smaller amount of a more flavored blend which is more my speed . For many years I didnt care for CB Royal but about a year or so ago I retried the Captain Black line , though I have yet to try the new Platinum , and I really like CB products it turns out
Freakin Bag Pipers Dream is way off the chart excellent .. now that type of European aromatic I really like . It has a softer mouth feel compared to many others from over there . McClelland Easy Street had the best mouth feel of any aromatic to me and Sutliffs Smooth Black and Gold had a great mouth feel too
I think Stokkebye is where Im heading for aromatics , now that Sutliff and MB 7 seas is gone because I like them very much . I know Im repeating myself but Im super happy that STG is keeping z50 black cordial . Its the epitome of a perfectly American styled killer aromatic and at the max level of flavor for me . SWRA is a chick magnet and its one I enjoy also
I cant do C&D stuff . I tried . I liked some C&D stuff in the early 90s but either I or it changed at some point . I also tried GLP stuff and cant do it . For me , there doesnt seem to be any highs or lows in that brand [ flavor wise ] , its all in the middle . . I even tried Hearth and home stuff and its a no go excep for a couple but I dont remember which .. a holiday one , I think
When you say you had a bad experience with lakelands years ago , it made me think of me having a bad experience with Yukon Jack back in the day , lol .
I love Bag Piper's Dream. It may say Rattray's on the label but it was manufactured by Kohlhase & Kopp. We all change over time and that is true of pipe tobacco also. It was either Mixture 79 or maybe Whitehall (if I remember correctly), or some other aromatic that I tried in the mid-1970s. All I know is it reminded me of the bath powders the old ladies in church would douse themselves with instead of taking a bath. You could smell them from 50-feet away. Anyway it was a real soapy aftertaste that I hated.
Speaking of Yukon Jack, my "bad" experience was with a bottle of Wild Turkey when I was at McMurdo Antartica in January 1974. I was only a lowly E-3 but was taken under the wing by a couple of the older engineers and the Engineering Officer who was ex-enlisted. Anyway, I drank over half a bottle of Turkey by myself. Woke up on a couch in the recreation area and didn't know how I got there. One of the guys on security watch found me, put a pillow under my head, covered me with a blanket and put a garbage pail next to me.
I couldn't drink bourbon for six months after that.
@PappyJoe ... if we ever meet up to smoke , remind me to tell you the story of the time I went to get a tattoo after bootcamp [ USN ] . I think you'll appreciate it
Comments
Facility Closures — Sutliff's closure is scheduled by the end of the first quarter of 2025. This is part of a broader strategy by STG to consolidate and streamline operations, which includes closing facilities and reducing brand diversity.
Market Control — The destruction of equipment is a deliberate effort by STG to control the market. By eliminating the possibility of competitors acquiring the machinery, STG aims to maintain dominance in the pipe tobacco industry.
Job Impact — The closure of Sutliff and the destruction of its equipment will likely lead to job losses. While STG has plans to move some employees to other facilities, the exact number of employees who will be retained is uncertain.
Historical Context — Unlike the natural closure of McClelland in 2018, which was due to sourcing difficulties and retirement, Sutliff's closure is a strategic decision despite its profitability. This highlights a shift in industry dynamics towards consolidation and market control.
Please contact your salesmen if you have any further questions.
804-233-7668-
Andrew Peck- ext. 232
Carolyn Hughes- ext. 220
Michelle Moran- ext. 217
Sharon Andre- ext. 210
Best Regards,
Jeremy McKenna >>
Just kidding….. or not.
I saw that price list.
The bad news (if we need more) is that those are the new prices that the shops are paying and retail will be higher.
I hope I'm wrong about that.
I would hope you are wrong, too, but commonsense would lead one to believe you are not…..
The idea of being ok with folks switching over to C&D aromatics is disconcerting because , imho , their products are just awful and STG can do way better than taking that attitude . I very much enjoy aromatics and Sutliff/MacBaren made the best by far .
I truly hope someone will rethink some of the blends back into existence in the near future
I know I sound like I'm bitching . I'm thankful that MacBaren Scottish and Sutliff Z50 Black Cordial made it !!
Id like to add that I think STG has done such a fantastic job , honestly . Their Half and Half is such an improvement from when it used to taste like Listerine [ I think that's when Pinkerton made it , I forget ] . All the OTC brands and the Captain Black products STG makes are fantastic .
Just rethink Golden Extra , please . I'm down to 2.5 lbs
Funny, my thoughts are the same as yours….except exactly the opposite. C&D (mostly) 👍🏻….Sutliff 😖
All of the Sutliff blends I ever had needed the moisture rung out of them (except Mixture 79) after some serious dry time there was only about 1/4-1/3 of a tin of tobacco left and that was still pretty wet, but smokeable. There was so much moisture in them that they rusted the sealed tins they came in.
I am going to miss some MacBaren blends😢
Anyway , Im getting used to blends disappearing . Since I started in 78 , theres a ton of things I smoked that are long gone . Nothing is scared it seems
Ahh, McClelland, I started this journey much later at the end of 2012. I was just learning my way around and ended up at a brick-and-mortar for “smoke-in” that a friend worked at. Sadly it was right after the time that indoor smoking was made a crime here in Montana……the shop proprietors were renegades and we did it anyway😬. I tried a sample tobak or two, and received several small samples to take home. I also got one of the door prizes, a flat black Zippo pipe lighter. Every time I strike it up it reminds me of that friend whom helped me start to figure out the pipe. He passed soon after that get together😢. I never got to make him the custom pipe I had planned to surprise him with. I was just figuring out how to make pipes as well. Back to McClelland…One of those tobaccos was Beacon, which I thoroughly enjoy. At the time, I was only buying a tin at a time trying to figure out my likes and dislikes. Well, you guessed it, one tin is all I got. I have about half of it left, and save it for special occasions. I did find out that I did not enjoy Beacon Extra, at the time, it had too much Perique. Now, with a few years of pipe smoking under my belt, I think I would enjoy it too, on occasion. I have found Sam Gawith’s “Cabbie’s Mixture” to be an ok substitute. I’d like to get my hands on some of the uncut rope some day.
Ya know , I never had a " cellar " for decades and decades until the damn internet , lol . I just bought what I wanted when I wanted . After the McClelland disaster and Dunhill being out of production a short time , is what kinda started me to start stocking up a bit but not heavy . I used to be a Germain Royal Jersey Perique smoker , I loved it , but it got stupid to find and I havent seen it in stock anywhere in years and I no longer care . Peterson Elizabethan is kinda similar enough . I have 1 unopened tin left and Ill save it for a special occasion ... like if I make it with a 25 year old buxom redhead or something truly cool like that
McClelland was the premier American manufacturer and that will never happen again , sadly . But the thing is that there really is a good bit of blends still available , though we lost at least 100 blends just the other day .
What bugs me is the " flavor profile " of a manufacturer , when they go away , then that flavor profile is gone forever .Each has their own and its such a cool thing
I used to smoke a lot of C&D and Sutliff aromatics until I was introduced to the Kohlhase & Kopp aromatics and Rattray's aromatics that were made by K&K. This lead me to other European aros made by companies like Dan Tobacco. Now that both Kopp and HU are being sold in the U.S., I'm hoping they make some more of their aromatics available.
I had a bad experience with Lakeland blends back in the 70s and it was only about 10 years ago that I decided to give them a try again. Now I enjoy them.
I get what you are saying about having a cellar. I didn't start buying multiple tins of pipe tobacco blends until about 10 years ago. I still don't have a cellar as huge as some of the guys on the other forums - mine is only about 13 lbs. total.
I tend to get an all black cavendish , a simple one .. say like BCA or Smokers Pride BC and add a smaller amount of a more flavored blend which is more my speed . For many years I didnt care for CB Royal but about a year or so ago I retried the Captain Black line , though I have yet to try the new Platinum , and I really like CB products it turns out
Freakin Bag Pipers Dream is way off the chart excellent .. now that type of European aromatic I really like . It has a softer mouth feel compared to many others from over there . McClelland Easy Street had the best mouth feel of any aromatic to me and Sutliffs Smooth Black and Gold had a great mouth feel too
I think Stokkebye is where Im heading for aromatics , now that Sutliff and MB 7 seas is gone because I like them very much . I know Im repeating myself but Im super happy that STG is keeping z50 black cordial . Its the epitome of a perfectly American styled killer aromatic and at the max level of flavor for me . SWRA is a chick magnet and its one I enjoy also
I cant do C&D stuff . I tried . I liked some C&D stuff in the early 90s but either I or it changed at some point . I also tried GLP stuff and cant do it . For me , there doesnt seem to be any highs or lows in that brand [ flavor wise ] , its all in the middle . . I even tried Hearth and home stuff and its a no go excep for a couple but I dont remember which .. a holiday one , I think
When you say you had a bad experience with lakelands years ago , it made me think of me having a bad experience with Yukon Jack back in the day , lol .
I love Bag Piper's Dream. It may say Rattray's on the label but it was manufactured by Kohlhase & Kopp.
We all change over time and that is true of pipe tobacco also. It was either Mixture 79 or maybe Whitehall (if I remember correctly), or some other aromatic that I tried in the mid-1970s. All I know is it reminded me of the bath powders the old ladies in church would douse themselves with instead of taking a bath. You could smell them from 50-feet away. Anyway it was a real soapy aftertaste that I hated.
Speaking of Yukon Jack, my "bad" experience was with a bottle of Wild Turkey when I was at McMurdo Antartica in January 1974. I was only a lowly E-3 but was taken under the wing by a couple of the older engineers and the Engineering Officer who was ex-enlisted. Anyway, I drank over half a bottle of Turkey by myself. Woke up on a couch in the recreation area and didn't know how I got there. One of the guys on security watch found me, put a pillow under my head, covered me with a blanket and put a garbage pail next to me.
I couldn't drink bourbon for six months after that.
You got it.
I survived 21 years in the Coast Guard without a tattoo.